OxtreeLAT

I still have a role in SSG captaincy. If I see bullshit, I'm gonna call it out. BiggestEight(@selänne8) has been one of the slimiest people around here(as proven in the previous posts). As far as my current role in staff - at this time I'm reconsidering my further involvement into the development and administration of the tournament.

I never would've thought that a team could be so desperate to get another ass whooping. Two blowout loses for HC Checkmate... Guess they are different. Well played BiggestEight and Hanssonni. You got another chance! Same exact slimy way that HC Checkmate used to get WO wins in the last season after purposely avoiding the other team and taking a break from the game. Truly fits your name. As for Kefleri - I'm glad that he joined our team and we would do it again if we had to. Being abused by his Refuse To Lose teammates and captain, spouting disgusting insults about his girlfriend and unborn child - that's unacceptable. Shame on you Hanssonni, shame on you Refuse To Lose. Shame, shame, shame. As for the game suspensions - when you contacted us, they were issued for the games against the next default opponent. As such, we acknowledged that and iced a suboptimal lineup for those games. If you plan to enforce them in the games against Nemesis, effectively punishing the two players for no reason, we'll appeal for a replay of our games against CAT. After all you seemingly have already set the ridiculous precedent for replaying games. - Ox, assistant captain of Silver Sword Griffins

Hello, SkorvMaskiin! Welcome to our community! Here's a link to the free agency thread. You might have better luck finding a team if you post there:

Still looking for a starting goalie.

Eh, from what I've seen... I'll just stick with Arma.

Silver Sword Griffins are looking for an active goalie and right defenceman for the upcoming ECL Pro tournament(and EASHL games in general). We try to play games almost every evening and share a "defense-first" mindset. The team consists of both Latvians and Finns - we mostly stick to English, so everyone's welcome to join. Guaranteed ECL and ice-time in general(G will have unchallenged "starter" role). If interested, contact me here or on PSN - OxtreeLAT.

Close your eyes when you dream, sunshine!

That glitch directly benefited Finnish Roosters, allowing them to score the GWG. The response? A recommendation from the staff to disallow the goal. The result? The goal stayed valid and turned out to be the GWG. I'm sorry, but how exactly is it fair when a team gets punished due to an oversight from the staff? Did you just expect them to sit there and take the punishment even though they had done nothing wrong? Also whenever it's a regular season or playoff game is irrelevant. All games should receive the same amount of attention and it definitely shouldn't affect the final ruling from the staff. It's been already said multiple times, but I'll repeat it again - throughout those two weeks Synergy pretty much wasn't able to play any games. If you looked at their club's recent games on Monday - they hadn't played a single EASHL game for 12 days. Hard to schedule something against a team that simply isn't there. It's mind-boggling that the more active team that also had held the lead of the series throughout the first 5 games is the one who gets WO loses(especially when there's a rule that stipulates the more active team getting WOs). It wasn't because of SSG that the games were pushed back to the very last day... Again, staff decides to schedule first round right in-between the holidays and now because another team isn't available for most of it, SSG gets fucked over. Amazing. Hell, at the very beginning of the first round Synergy basically came out flying with ultimatums that they simply wouldn't play any games till January 2nd. What?! When you look at it, SSG was very understanding, trying to make things happen (SSGs GM - "Let us know if you manage to gather 6 in any of the upcoming days... we'll stay on standby"). STANDBY. Yes, standby. It was that bad. SSG ends up not being able to play on two occasions due to some of their players having work(mind you, the scheduling of one of those days was very much a "last-minute" thing). Synergy? They weren't there for the majority of the days and now they advance. The team who tried to make things work and adapt to the other side, giving in and making compromises, got the short end of the stick. With this ruling the staff has set a very ugly precedent and from what I've heard, if by some miracle SSG decides to join next season, there will be significantly less sportsmanship and adapting to opponent's needs and schedule. After all with this latest case we've all seen how a team throwing tantrums and ultimatums gets their way. Props to Synergy for figuring out the way to abuse the system and get further ahead. Guess some teams had too much class, integrity and didn't have the guts to go straight for the jugular. Tho that's about to change. Not surprising. It's "we do believe both teams have made mistakes in this series", yet the more popular Swedish team gets their way and the underdog is punished for all the mistakes. Not the first time and definitely won't be the last. What was the saying? It pays to have friends in high places...

Laser HT - TIKI TALK 4-0Aapon Taikasauva - Fat Cats 4-0Northern Stars - Northern Ascendancy 4-3Written in the Stars - Nordic Nightmare 4-3Synergy Hockey - Mukihiemet -2-4X Factor - Dynasty 4-3SIKA - Nordic Lightning 3-4Finnish Roosters - Nordic Blizzard 4-3

Another instance that shows this tournament is very much about personal relations and being buddies with certain people. At this point it very much looks like everything revolves around Finns and Swedes, anyone else is here just so this whole farce could be called "European" Championship League. Tho I truly hope I'm wrong on that. An underdog who had the lead of the series gets the short end of the stick while a very popular team advances with WO wins. An underdog who was available for the majority of the allocated days for the first round. Popularity contest... Especially when you look at Synergy's "show" yesterday to stream themselves waiting for SSG in challenge room. Pathetic. That's two incidents in a row where SSG ends up getting screwed by staff's oversight - case against FR with missing rules and now this... Maybe scheduling round 1 during holidays wasn't such a good idea after all. Wonder how long it will take for someone to realize it... I truly hope SSG continues, but after this bullshit... Can't really blame them if they were to decide in favor of abandoning this mess. I'll leave you with this... "In case there are any unplayed games after this deadline, the administration will investigate the issue and hand out walkover wins for the team that was more active in trying to get the games scheduled and played in time." A team that didn't play a single game for 12 days advances to the next round! Bravo, Synergy! Bravo!

Was in party playing other games with some of the SSG members yesterday and the captain's comment about "sub-optimal" roster was inaccurate(from what I understood he got fed up being forced to always adapt to other team's needs and ultimatums that resulted in that comment). Someone from actual SSG can correct this if I'm wrong, but from what I got 3 of their players weren't available - C, G(both due to work) and LW(due to personal reasons) and that created a situation where they simply didn't have 6 players. Regardless of optimal/sub-optimal, they couldn't ice any line-up due to missing too many guys.

Well then tell me how that it's not the truth. Yesterday out of curiosity I looked up Synergy's stats via EA's website and before Monday you hadn't played a single game in 12 days. Prove that I'm wrong and I'll gladly take my words back. I may not be on the team, but I still know quite a few people there and heard plenty of stuff yesterday about this whole mess.

Love people who make wild assumptions without knowing all the facts. Not the smartest thing to do...

Now that's funny. Especially when I've heard that this whole mess started because of Synergy not being available in the first two weeks and not playing a single game in that time. Hilarious.

That's fine with me. All I want to see is that at the end of the day we don't reach another SSG vs FR situation where admins are only able to recommend a course of action where one of the involved parties can just chose whichever solution fits them the best, completely ignoring the core principles of the rulebook - providing fair and competitive environment for all teams. That's all. Otherwise if there's another issue like this where a team suffers due to an in-game bug and it not being covered in the rules - you can expect the same wall of text. Tho I guess in that case it will be easier... More of a "copy/paste" kinda deal.

Not surprising since you've always seemingly had a beef with the administration. In my eyes they have done a great job with all the previous tournaments and with their track record I truly can't see a reason why they can't be trusted(otherwise we're starting to look like bunch of people with tinfoil hats). Sure, it is 22 pages long, but as you can imagine, a tournament that has a prize pool of $75 000 requires a significantly more rules and regulations. Also nowhere did I mention "general guidelines". Say whatever you want, but the core principle is there - admins still have the final say. Sure, we don't have access to the developers, but there are plenty of times when a bug is clearly evident and there's no need to "call EA Sports". Also from what I hear nobody was asking to void the whole game. The only question was whenever or not the third goal scored by FR was gonna be disallowed/allowed, continuing game where it left off. That's it. Also I don't see how something like this could be used to gain a significant advantage. Sure, you'll get a break, but as seen in the past with player disconnects - the time remaining and any PK/PP scenario from the previous game stays valid. Hell, now that we're talking about it - what if a goalie disconnects when there's a skater on a breakaway? Will it again come down to the common courtesy and sportsmanship of one side or will the staff finally get to do something about it?

I disagree with the idea that staff should only be allowed to make a ruling if there are rules that cover said situations. I feel like the solution of having vague rules would only be there as a "checkmark" and it would still leave a room for people to argue the "it's not in the rules, it's fair game". You're essentially adapting the same thing I'm asking for, just with a vague set of rules to go with it. Here's an example. If I remember correctly in one of the Pro League finals for Rainbow Six Siege in Bank - a professional esports scene - there was an invisibility glitch that happened during one of the matches. No rules covered said situation, they contacted the admins and Ubisoft developers(in our case it would be the staff), asked for their decision and they canceled that whole round. The players themselves had no say in this decision. And that's an esports competition with serious prize pool of $75 000. Actually, here's a link to the video: The whole thing starts at around 1 hour 50 minutes. The build-up is rather slow as the casters don't have the information right away, but they start discussing the actual bug and the solution at 2 hours 5 minutes and then 2 hours 13 minutes. Would love to see what @Kenu take on this is. Bottom line - this example shows how things like these are handled in a professional environment. I don't understand why we need to reinvent the wheel and try to make things even more complicated by potentially leaving room for other issues.

I disagree. This isn't court. There are things in this game that are gamebreaking and if they aren't covered in the rules and staff just lets them slide/doesn't fix them, they essentially punish the teams that become the first victims of them. The core principle of the rulebook should be to provide a fair and competitive environment where teams can compete. That's it. Sadly I didn't see it happening in the incident between SSG and FR where essentially one team was punished due to an in-game bug/staff's oversight. If rules prevent them from giving fair and sportsmanlike rulings within the spirit of the rules... Something's clearly wrong. Either way I've made my case. I just wonder how the community would react if there was a case of G getting stuck and giving up GWG in an elimination game. Funny how perspective works.

Yes, they have demonstrated their ability to change the rules and adapt when it comes down to relatively easy subjects where there's little risk of backlash from the community. That said, when it's about something that will rough feathers - they play softball. From what I've heard, in the case between SSG and FR it changed. Instead of issuing an actual ruling and adapting, they went with a recommendation where the side that benefited from the glitch could still keep the advantage and completely disregard their recommendation. Now looking at the game report - the score stayed the same and goal was deemed as a good goal. I don't know about you, but in my eyes that's far from a "non-issue" when the staff recognizes that there's something wrong, but can't enforce it and leave it up to the teams to decide. We've clearly seen multiple times that this community isn't ready for something like that. Basically they've set a precedent where if a member of a "Team X" gets stuck in an animation(worst case scenario it's G) and the "Team Y" scores, directly benefiting from this bug, it's up to "Team Y" to decide if they count it as a good goal. At the end the main thing that I want to get is a clear indication of staff's position. As you said - at one point they have the power to change things, yet at another their hands are tied. This is crucial for integrity of any future tournaments as there are plenty of people who have the mindset of "if it's not in the rules, it's a fair game". People basically need to know if the administration can enforce a ruling even in the cases when something pops up that's not in the rulebook... Or are we looking at a situation where everything needs to be covered in the rulebook and there are no rulings that can be made if the regulations don't cover said incidents. Anyway, I have a feeling that Kenu's report will shed some much needed light on these recent events. Now to GMs - I'm personally all for giving the actual players more ways to have their voices heard and give them a chance to mold this tournament to their liking. That said, the staff should still be solely responsible for enforcing the actual rules. Also with the current division system, if something like that comes to life, every division should be represented, not just the "elite".

In light of the recent events I feel like it's time to take a closer look at the current regulations and their purpose. As Finnish Roosters demonstrated, there are still some cancerous teams in this community that will try to further their cause at all costs. Their lack of class, sportsmanship and fair play is evident to everyone. As seen in their post-game comment - they have the "if it's not in the rules, it's a fair game" mindset. To keep teams like this in check we need to refine the current rulebook and the way it's used. Rules should be considered as a tool that the staff can use in order to enforce basic standards and behavior. Not "be all, say all" kinda deal. The final decision and authority should still come down to the staff. In unique circumstances where there are no rules covering the specific situation, they should still have the ability to make a ruling that the teams are required to follow. A recommendation that they can just ignore - that's not good enough. Currently it looks like the staff's hands are tied by the very same rules that are supposed to be there to help them. The result? A situation where a team(Finnish Roosters) essentially can chose whichever solution suits them the best, completely ignoring fair play, sportsmanship and the core goal of the regulations - providing fair, competitive environment. As seen, our community clearly isn't mature enough to be able to look at these things objectively and come up with a reasonable solution. The glitches will come and go and the staff needs to have the ability to react on the fly, implement new rules if required and enforce them accordingly. It's a game, there will be bugs. Same with the rulebook and loopholes in it. The community clearly isn't able to deal with it and seeing how some people behave - simple A-Z regulations in my eyes don't work. As such I urge people to start an early discussion about the current rules and the potential changes to them for the upcoming ECL 4. For example, a thing that somehow slipped everyone - Gs bunny hop bug(https://clips.twitch.tv/thecreasetv/CalmDogUnSane). If something like this happens, will it be treated the same as the situation between SSG vs FR where it's up to the opponent to decide what they want to do? All down to whenever or not the other team is understanding and values sportsmanship/fair play enough to clear the puck? Seems a bit fucked up, especially when we've seen what Finnish Roosters would do with the "read the rules, it's not there" mindset.

In general - quite happy about the overall look of the upcoming division system. I'm glad that you didn't ignore the feedback on the promotion/relegation system and the fact that new teams simply can't fast-track their way straight to the Elite without playing a single season. Also whilst I'm not a big fan of making such delicate decisions come down to personal opinions, I understand the need for such exceptions and the fact that looking at it on case-by-case basis is probably the best approach to the whole situation. Bring on ECL 4! Edit: Also to the people who are concerned about teams dropping out - there have always been multiple teams abandoning the tournaments mid-season, regardless of the regulations. It's safe to say that some will also drop with the new rules in place. Does that mean they're a failure? In my opinion - not at all. With this system in place there will be less blowout games and pretty much everyone participating will have something to fight for against teams of similar skill.

Well this thread turned ugly real quick. Lets face it - there are both good reasons for and against it. Either way - it's rather obvious that there's one side pushing their own personal agenda in order to get them in a better position for the upcoming tournaments. That said, I'm personally against giving teams a free pass, regardless of the circumstances. Why? Because it completely undermines the whole division system and at that point one can easily question why there's a need for such system in the first place. Also this would set a precedent where other teams could try doing the same and ask for a free pass to advance to higher divisions. Who will decide if a team belongs to be placed in a higher division? Who exactly has the knowledge and capabilities to accurately determine which team belongs in which division? I can only see it turning into an ugly, highly opinionated and subjective mess. For this to work there needs to be a solid set of ground-rules that clearly define the divisions and the whole promotion/relegation process. There's no room for subjectivity or opinions, otherwise this whole community will be a dumpster fire with constant arguing.

PSN: OxtreeLAT Position: G, C, RW, RD In short - Latvian hockey lunatic. I've been playing NHL since NHL 03'. Switched to PS4 late last year and represented Silver Sword Griffins(SSG) in both ECL tournaments(mostly as a goalie). Have no desire to be a captain(from the looks of it we already have plenty of quality candidates).

Haven't really paid much attention to the potential matchups for the second round, but I'd like to apologize in advance to all the teams in the "Group 5-8" conference since our opponent seemingly refuses to play the games and it might take longer to finish the series. For every attempt to schedule the next games all we receive is "maybe" .