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OxtreeLAT

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Posts posted by OxtreeLAT

  4. EU Clubs looking for players - PlayStation 5 & Xbox Series X|S

    in EASHL Teams

    Posted

    On 2/6/2017 at 1:13 AM, OxtreeLAT said:

     

    Silver Sword Griffins are looking for an active goalie and right defenceman for the upcoming ECL Pro tournament(and EASHL games in general). We try to play games almost every evening and share a "defense-first" mindset. The team consists of both Latvians and Finns - we mostly stick to English, so everyone's welcome to join.

    Guaranteed ECL and ice-time in general(G will have unchallenged "starter" role).

    If interested, contact me here or on PSN - OxtreeLAT.

    Still looking for a starting goalie.

    • Like 1

  6. EU Clubs looking for players - PlayStation 5 & Xbox Series X|S

    in EASHL Teams

    Posted

    Silver Sword Griffins are looking for an active goalie and right defenceman for the upcoming ECL Pro tournament(and EASHL games in general). We try to play games almost every evening and share a "defense-first" mindset. The team consists of both Latvians and Finns - we mostly stick to English, so everyone's welcome to join.

    Guaranteed ECL and ice-time in general(G will have unchallenged "starter" role).

    If interested, contact me here or on PSN - OxtreeLAT.

    • Like 6

  10. Playoff Round 2 Potential Matchups

    in NHL 24

    Posted

    19 minutes ago, iSvamp said:

    Well, I have some facts. Cuz I have seen the whole conversation (fan vad tråkigt för de inblandade, hur kunde detta hända?) 

    Så gubbar, sluta kasta skit på SSG, detta är ju lite konstigare än man först trodde. 

    This is the conversation between Synergy and SSG (I will put it out in text instead of pictures)

    (latvian time)
    (From SSG 29/12/16)
    -     Let us know if you manage to gather 6 in any of the upcoming days... we'll stay on standby

    (From Synergy 30/12/16)
    -So, whats your thoughts about monday, when are you available?

    (From SSG 31/12/16) 
    - I think we should be good to play on monday

    (From Synergy 02/01/16)
    -     Ok cool, we are ready from 20.30. (11:06)
    - CET (I guess thats 21.30 in Latvia?) (11:11)

    (From SSG)
    -     Okey (13.46)

    (From Synergy)
    -     So, whats your status? (17:11)
    - Are you there? (18:31)

    (From SSG)
    -     yes yes
    - We got 6 (18:34)

    (From Synergy)
    -     How many games (at most) 3? (19:13)

    (From SSG)
    - Yeah, something like that.
    - 5min and ready (19:32)

    ("Something like that", "something like that", not a full answer for Synergy)

    (From Synergy)
    -     invite coming (19:38) 

    (From SSG)
    -     Ready (19:39)

    (From Synergy)
    - One more? (20:27) (don't think SSG understod this message, you will see later)

    (From SSG)
    - yes (20:27)
    - Can you keep playing? (20:51)

    (From Synergy)
    - We can't :/. Can u tomorrow? (20:54)

    (From SSG)
    -     idk
    - I will be off to work (20:54) -    (Now Synergy knows that SSG can't play the day after - still time to get 6 players online to continue the last games)
    - 2 games (at most) left, sure you can't finish tonight? (20:58)

    (From Synergy)
     - one already went to sleep (21:00) -  (I guess he isn't sleeping after 9 minutes, not a big problem?) (Synergy still knows that SSG can't play the day after)

    (From SSG)
    -     backup? (21:00)

    (From Synergy)
    - All others are still on vacation (21:02) - (Okey, I know that Craig "Oskuldsfull" went on a trip to norway, but I saw Berbaboon, pelles brother online many hours after this message in NHL 17 when I searched for a club to play some games in, and that 2 hours later)

    (From SSG)
    -     It's 10Pm in sweden... Anyway, if you're not able to continue, that's fine, but we can't play tomorrow, cuz tonight is my last day off from New year's holidays, and our G will most likely get a call from his job tomorrow to come for night shift too (not 100% tho) (21:07)

    (Synergy still knows that SSG can't play the day after)  

    (From Synergy)
    -     Okey, maybe we can get permission to play on wednesday? (21:19)

    (From SSG)
    - We should be able to play on wednesday (21:24)

    (From Synergy)
    - Ok, I need to talk with Kenu and Co then (21:29)

    (From SSG)
    - ye, you do that then... See if they're happy to do so
    3/1-17

    (Synergy still knows that SSG can't play this day, nothing has changed)

    (From Synergy) 
    -     Got answer from Kenu now and he said that we should try to play since this already is an extra day to play the first round (12:47)

    (From SSG)
    - I told you yesterday that we can't. We don't have to play with a subobtimal roster just because you couldn't play at all last two weeks. (14:21) 

    ** I guess SSG's goalie was the guy that couldn't play - suboptimal**

    - We could've finished the games yesterday but see Pelle I think it was who called it a night at 10 PM. And now we have to adapt to that? (14:25)

    (From Synergy)
    -     yes you told me AFTER the 3 games yesterday that you couldn't play tomorrow. I asked you before how many games we should play, and suggested 3. and you answered "yeah something like that" and when I asked for one more after 2 you said "yes". 
    - So I assumed then that we could continue today. (14:25)

    (From SSG)
    - you assumed.... Cuz I never said that we could play today I',m off to work in 25min, so won't be reachable till break after few hours
    - we should've finished at deadline. (14:27)

    ___________________________________

    Synergy? Even tho that U knew that SSG couldn't play yesterday, and you already knew it the day before. Why the "Hell" did you went to DR, started your stream and said in the chat that it was games going? You maked them look like idiots. You even started a poll "should we wait more", you already knew that they couldn't play. (you waited for ghosts?!?!?!?!)

    *We asked in your chat about the situation, you answered "radio silence". Well, was it the truth? 
    *You also said that they couldn't play b/c off "suboptimal team" - Well, I guess you could have continued with berbaboon instead of Pelle the day before then.

    *You did a move to get in contact with the "15min WO rule" - And after have seen this conversation is it disgusting. what a move by a classy team. Why are you always involved with the WO situations during playoffs?

    I'm not sure what the staff will do about it, but I hope you guys get's an extra day to play the remaining games, I want to see a winner from the ice, not the staff. And if someone deserves the WO, should it actually be SSG if we look at the rulebook. 

    " In case there are any unplayed games after this deadline, the administration will investigate the issue and hand out walkover wins for the team that was more active in trying to get the games scheduled and played in time. "

    But I've seen that the Staff are on your side - and even that is confusing. 



     

     

     


     

    Was in party playing other games with some of the SSG members yesterday and the captain's comment about "sub-optimal" roster was inaccurate(from what I understood he got fed up being forced to always adapt to other team's needs and ultimatums that resulted in that comment). Someone from actual SSG can correct this if I'm wrong, but from what I got 3 of their players weren't available - C, G(both due to work) and LW(due to personal reasons) and that created a situation where they simply didn't have 6 players. Regardless of optimal/sub-optimal, they couldn't ice any line-up due to missing too many guys.

    • Like 1

  11. Playoff Round 2 Potential Matchups

    in NHL 24

    Posted · Edited by OxtreeLAT

    6 minutes ago, Egyptologen said:

     

     

    Well then tell me how that it's not the truth. Yesterday out of curiosity I looked up Synergy's stats via EA's website and before Monday you hadn't played a single game in 12 days. Prove that I'm wrong and I'll gladly take my words back.

    I may not be on the team, but I still know quite a few people there and heard plenty of stuff yesterday about this whole mess.

  13. Playoff Round 2 Potential Matchups

    in NHL 24

    Posted

    5 minutes ago, Bjono said:

    But yeah it could take weeks to gett SSG availible again;)

    Now that's funny. Especially when I've heard that this whole mess started because of Synergy not being available in the first two weeks and not playing a single game in that time. Hilarious. 

    • Like 2

  14. ECL 4 - Rules and potential changes.

    in European Championship League - PS5 & Xbox Series X|S(6v6)

    Posted

    7 minutes ago, Egyptologen said:

    I was hoping I didn't have to go into a deeper explanation but here we go.

    The rules are not vague. The one I just took as an example is a non exhaustive general rule to adress the issue that EA glitches that have a serious impact on a teams ability to defend themselves, should not be responsible for goals. Now this is the aim of the rule. As with any rule there needs to be an aim, or a goal so to speak. So once the aim is established you need to decide what type of rule would suit the need. Sometimes the rule needs to be specific to exclude other similar situations or behaviour, but sometimes the rule needs to be non exhaustive so it doesn't exclude similar situations that still falls within the aim of the rule. This does not make the rule vague. 

    Admins will always play a key roll because they are the ones interpreting the situations according with the rules. But to say for example  - your behaviour is bad even if it is not in the rules, lets have admins decided what to do - is not very appropriate. In that case we might as well just have a vote in such instances (where people will vote what is in their team's best interest). Or we just go back to the old "tgma decides" and no one knows what is right or wrong until admins made their decision.

    That's fine with me. All I want to see is that at the end of the day we don't reach another SSG vs FR situation where admins are only able to recommend a course of action where one of the involved parties can just chose whichever solution fits them the best, completely ignoring the core principles of the rulebook - providing fair and competitive environment for all teams. That's all.

    Otherwise if there's another issue like this where a team suffers due to an in-game bug and it not being covered in the rules - you can expect the same wall of text. Tho I guess in that case it will be easier... More of a "copy/paste" kinda deal. 

    • Like 1

  15. ECL 4 - Rules and potential changes.

    in European Championship League - PS5 & Xbox Series X|S(6v6)

    Posted · Edited by OxtreeLAT

    39 minutes ago, Billy44205 said:

    Yeah I don't trust NHLGamer staff enough to gladly surrender too much power to them. Also we don't have access to EA Vancouver devs lol.

    Also according to this :

    http://cdn2.esl.tv/fileadmin/user_upload/Rainbow6/Tom_Clancys_Rainbow_Six_Season-3_Rulebook_2016.pdf

    The rulebook for this Pro League is 22 pages long. So much for general guidelines...

    I'm basically on Egyptologen's side on this matter, although I guess I can live with admins voiding (note that they don't punish the team, they just void one game) results such as the FR vs SSG game. Maybe. Then again this is one tricky thing because isn't it like, way easy to fake a goalie freeze glitch and us it to your advantage? I dunno, I'm not interested in getting into the specifics and it's someone else's job.

    Not surprising since you've always seemingly had a beef with the administration. In my eyes they have done a great job with all the previous tournaments and with their track record I truly can't see a reason why they can't be trusted(otherwise we're starting to look like bunch of people with tinfoil hats).

    Sure, it is 22 pages long, but as you can imagine, a tournament that has a prize pool of $75 000 requires a significantly more rules and regulations. Also nowhere did I mention "general guidelines". Say whatever you want, but the core principle is there - admins still have the final say. Sure, we don't have access to the developers, but there are plenty of times when a bug is clearly evident and there's no need to "call EA Sports".

    Also from what I hear nobody was asking to void the whole game. The only question was whenever or not the third goal scored by FR was gonna be disallowed/allowed, continuing game where it left off. That's it.

    Also I don't see how something like this could be used to gain a significant advantage. Sure, you'll get a break, but as seen in the past with player disconnects - the time remaining and any PK/PP scenario from the previous game stays valid.

    Hell, now that we're talking about it - what if a goalie disconnects when there's a skater on a breakaway? Will it again come down to the common courtesy and sportsmanship of one side or will the staff finally get to do something about it?

  16. ECL 4 - Rules and potential changes.

    in European Championship League - PS5 & Xbox Series X|S(6v6)

    Posted · Edited by OxtreeLAT

    2 hours ago, Egyptologen said:

    What are you disagreeing with? I said things need to be covered by the rulebook to be applicable. Rules and law is essentially the same thing. The difference is rules applies to certain people for certain things where law applies to everybody within its reach.

    Rules can cover everything if they are smart enough. For example name a possible glitch similar to SSGs that would counter a rule that said "any goal occured through a glitch not triggered by any of the participating members, shall not count"

    Just an example

    I disagree with the idea that staff should only be allowed to make a ruling if there are rules that cover said situations. I feel like the solution of having vague rules would only be there as a "checkmark" and it would still leave a room for people to argue the "it's not in the rules, it's fair game". You're essentially adapting the same thing I'm asking for, just with a vague set of rules to go with it.

    Here's an example. If I remember correctly in one of the Pro League finals for Rainbow Six Siege in Bank - a professional esports scene - there was an invisibility glitch that happened during one of the matches. No rules covered said situation, they contacted the admins and Ubisoft developers(in our case it would be the staff), asked for their decision and they canceled that whole round. The players themselves had no say in this decision.  And that's an esports competition with serious prize pool of $75 000.

    Actually, here's a link to the video:

    The whole thing starts at around 1 hour 50 minutes. The build-up is rather slow as the casters don't have the information right away, but they start discussing the actual bug and the solution at 2 hours 5 minutes and then 2 hours 13 minutes. Would love to see what @Kenu take on this is.

    Bottom line - this example shows how things like these are handled in a professional environment. I don't understand why we need to reinvent the wheel and try to make things even more complicated by potentially leaving room for other issues.

     

    • Like 4

  17. ECL 4 - Rules and potential changes.

    in European Championship League - PS5 & Xbox Series X|S(6v6)

    Posted

    1 minute ago, Egyptologen said:

    Definitely no!

    "Nulla poena sine lege (Latin for "no penalty without a law") is a legal principle, requiring that one cannot be punished for doing something that is not prohibited by law. This principle is accepted and codified in modern democratic states as a basic requirement of the rule of law.[1]"

    There can't be actions taken without the support of rules. This does not mean that rules need to be exhaustive. They can be specific or general, including excluding, exhaustive non exhaustive, its about writing the right type of rule for a certain situation. 

    I disagree. This isn't court. There are things in this game that are gamebreaking and if they aren't covered in the rules and staff just lets them slide/doesn't fix them, they essentially punish the teams that become the first victims of them. The core principle of the rulebook should be to provide a fair and competitive environment where teams can compete. That's it. Sadly I didn't see it happening in the incident between SSG and FR where essentially one team was punished due to an in-game bug/staff's oversight.

    If rules prevent them from giving fair and sportsmanlike rulings within the spirit of the rules... Something's clearly wrong. Either way I've made my case. I just wonder how the community would react if there was a case of G getting stuck and giving up GWG in an elimination game. Funny how perspective works.

  18. ECL 4 - Rules and potential changes.

    in European Championship League - PS5 & Xbox Series X|S(6v6)

    Posted · Edited by OxtreeLAT

    2 hours ago, Billy44205 said:

    If I'm not mistaken the staff have already demonstrated the ability to amend rules on the fly when issues were brought up, such as the arena props thing. So that's a non-issue imo.

    Now, should there be a rule about players freezing similar to players disconnecting? Sure why not? I think everyone agrees here. It's a little unfair to blame them for not having the amendment ready when this was the first instance where people complained about this glitch in any significant way. Non-issue.

    Should the rules be updated? Of course. For instance the disconnection rules are written for NHL16 at a time when club challenges were not possible. And let's face it, the people who chose to give one team the choice between leaving immediately and waiting till the end of the period, those people were wrong. Since once again everyone seems to be in favor of leaving games right when people disconnect it should be the rule in the future. There's a few items like this that need rethinking. The book is already updated every season. Could it be done better? Sure, and I myself complained about the rulebook updates that I believe are retarded. But at least the process is ongoing, it's just a matter of resources on the task imo. Issue? Meh, kinda but not really...

    Back to the FR vs SSG incident, I have not followed the story that much but if the staff made a ruling about this occurrence of the freezing glitch, at least it sets a precedent for the remainder of the tournament, or as I said they can just add a rule like they have already done in this very tournament. If they don't do either of these things, THEN you can complain about the staff. Yay! 

     

    One last thing: The staff already has plenty ernough power, and in fact I would advocate for them to have less, but that would come with more accountability from other people. I have written in the ECL wishlist thread that I wanted to see a board of team GM's that would be, among other things, tasked with approving rulebooks and rule changes on the fly throughout seasons. I think it's time people embraced the rulebook which is the key to this tournament structure, rather than take it for granted and then complain about détails. Of course, if you've already embraced it, you are free to complain about it to your heart's content and in a constructive way. Like I do lol.

    Yes, they have demonstrated their ability to change the rules and adapt when it comes down to relatively easy subjects where there's little risk of backlash from the community. That said, when it's about something that will rough feathers - they play softball. From what I've heard, in the case between SSG and FR it changed. Instead of issuing an actual ruling and adapting, they went with a recommendation where the side that benefited from the glitch could still keep the advantage and completely disregard their recommendation. Now looking at the game report - the score stayed the same and goal was deemed as a good goal. I don't know about you, but in my eyes that's far from a "non-issue" when the staff recognizes that there's something wrong, but can't enforce it and leave it up to the teams to decide. We've clearly seen multiple times that this community isn't ready for something like that.

    Basically they've set a precedent where if a member of a "Team X" gets stuck in an animation(worst case scenario it's G) and the "Team Y" scores, directly benefiting from this bug, it's up to "Team Y" to decide if they count it as a good goal.

    At the end the main thing that I want to get is a clear indication of staff's position. As you said - at one point they have the power to change things, yet at another their hands are tied. This is crucial for integrity of any future tournaments as there are plenty of people who have the mindset of "if it's not in the rules, it's a fair game". People basically need to know if the administration can enforce a ruling even in the cases when something pops up that's not in the rulebook... Or are we looking at a situation where everything needs to be covered in the rulebook and there are no rulings that can be made if the regulations don't cover said incidents.

    Anyway, I have a feeling that Kenu's report will shed some much needed light on these recent events.

    Now to GMs - I'm personally all for giving the actual players more ways to have their voices heard and give them a chance to mold this tournament to their liking. That said, the staff should still be solely responsible for enforcing the actual rules. Also with the current division system, if something like that comes to life, every division should be represented, not just the "elite".

    • Like 1

  19. ECL 4 - Rules and potential changes.

    in European Championship League - PS5 & Xbox Series X|S(6v6)

    Posted · Edited by OxtreeLAT

    In light of the recent events I feel like it's time to take a closer look at the current regulations and their purpose. As Finnish Roosters demonstrated, there are still some cancerous teams in this community that will try to further their cause at all costs. Their lack of class, sportsmanship and fair play is evident to everyone. As seen in their post-game comment - they have the "if it's not in the rules, it's a fair game" mindset. To keep teams like this in check we need to refine the current rulebook and the way it's used. 

    Rules should be considered as a tool that the staff can use in order to enforce basic standards and behavior. Not "be all, say all" kinda deal. The final decision and authority should still come down to the staff. In unique circumstances where there are no rules covering the specific situation, they should still have the ability to make a ruling that the teams are required to follow. A recommendation that they can just ignore - that's not good enough. Currently it looks like the staff's hands are tied by the very same rules that are supposed to be there to help them. The result? A situation where a team(Finnish Roosters) essentially can chose whichever solution suits them the best, completely ignoring fair play, sportsmanship and the core goal of the regulations - providing fair, competitive environment. As seen, our community clearly isn't mature enough to be able to look at these things objectively and come up with a reasonable solution.

    The glitches will come and go and the staff needs to have the ability to react on the fly, implement new rules if required and enforce them accordingly. It's a game, there will be bugs. Same with the rulebook and loopholes in it. The community clearly isn't able to deal with it and seeing how some people behave - simple A-Z regulations in my eyes don't work.

    As such I urge people to start an early discussion about the current rules and the potential changes to them for the upcoming ECL 4.

    For example, a thing that somehow slipped everyone - Gs bunny hop bug(https://clips.twitch.tv/thecreasetv/CalmDogUnSane). If something like this happens, will it be treated the same as the situation between SSG vs FR where it's up to the opponent to decide what they want to do? All down to whenever or not the other team is understanding and values sportsmanship/fair play enough to clear the puck? Seems a bit fucked up, especially when we've seen what Finnish Roosters would do with the "read the rules, it's not there" mindset.
     

    • Like 6

  20. ECL wishlist

    in European Championship League - PS5 & Xbox Series X|S(6v6)

    Posted

    Well this thread turned ugly real quick. Lets face it - there are both good reasons for and against it. Either way - it's rather obvious that there's one side pushing their own personal agenda in order to get them in a better position for the upcoming tournaments.

    That said, I'm personally against giving teams a free pass, regardless of the circumstances. Why? Because it completely undermines the whole division system and at that point one can easily question why there's a need for such system in the first place. Also this would set a precedent where other teams could try doing the same and ask for a free pass to advance to higher divisions. Who will decide if a team belongs to be placed in a higher division? Who exactly has the knowledge and capabilities to accurately determine which team belongs in which division? I can only see it turning into an ugly, highly opinionated and subjective mess. For this to work there needs to be a solid set of ground-rules that clearly define the divisions and the whole promotion/relegation process. There's no room for subjectivity or opinions, otherwise this whole community will be a dumpster fire with constant arguing.

    • Like 8

  23. Unequal teams in this tournament?

    in SportsGamer Feedback & Questions

    Posted · Edited by OxtreeLAT

    7 minutes ago, biister said:

    You seem to have so much anger in you that you just charged here to insult Pelle3000 who has nothing to do with the serie between TUK and Grr? 9_9 and checking out your previous posts you might have an issue with all the hatred.

    I guess you misunderstood me. It wasn't aimed towards Pelle, I was talking about things in general. Also I'm perfectly calm, just sharing my opinion and participating in this discussion. There's no need to call me "angry" just because you disagree with me.

    All I see here is someone who seems to be rather defensive after being called out on valid reasons and now is trying his hardest to deflect the attention from the real issue. By the way - thanks for checking our my post history. Did you find anything of interest? 

    • Like 1

  24. Unequal teams in this tournament?

    in SportsGamer Feedback & Questions

    Posted

    3 minutes ago, Pelle3000 said:

    Obviously this late in the game teams want to use "best" possible lineup and it's not easy having 12 guys being able to play. With that said, 10 days seems more than enough, and maybe u can lose one hour of sleep once a week to get games going. If teams played 3 games first playable date it might speed things up. 

    Sure, I get that teams want to ice the very best line-up they've got, but at some point you have to give in and sacrifice certain things in order to complete all the games. The backup players are there for a reason. Same with the deadlines - you have to respect them. If you know that you're not gonna be able to schedule all the games with your #1 line-up and you still refuse to make those sacrifices/changes... That's clearly showing disrespect towards everyone else in the community as these people now have to wait on you to complete those games. All because of your selfishness and incompetence.

    • Like 3

  25. Unequal teams in this tournament?

    in SportsGamer Feedback & Questions

    Posted

    Just gonna put this out there - during our series against TUK we played games on Tuesday and Thursday. They wanted to take a day off in-between because they didn't have enough players, We didn't mind since there was no rush and we got plenty of time to play out the remaining games. Now here's the funny thing - during that "day off" we also got matched up against them via regular matchmaking. Full teams, 6vs6. A bit odd, but we still went along with it and were willing to play just a regular game. What happened next? They backed out every single time...

    • Like 1
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